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Youtube.

         

More indie bullshit. Overly serious. Hipsters playing in the forest. Shot nicely though. Some Data Mosh.

         

Boring. Look to the video below your post Mr Modular to see an example of cutting edge.

         

who the hell said anything about videos having to be cutting edge? That's just ridiculous. I like it. True though, Kansas, overly serious, but I kinda didn't notice that until you mentioned it. Got distracted by the nice photography, I like how the drab, limited color palette makes that dirty key-job pop.

         

Generally videos dont have to be cutting edge but Modular's whole thing is about being part of cutting edge culture and selling their idea of what's new and cool to kids.

         

I'm not sure that comparing this to Keith's video is particularly fair...

         

im digging this.

         

that is a bullshit comparison to make...

anyways, this video isn't perfect but it is built off of alot of really nice, well told moments. really love the low super wide angle stuff in the forest.

the rural/ woods/ coastal setting is a very fresh visual treatment to this song... as apposed to shooting some urban sydney, skate-grime locations or something.

         

Why is the comparison bullshit? Why is it unfair? They are both music videos are they not? Both in a similar genre of music and cultural placement are they not? I don't see why they can't be compared.

Also what are talking about 'fresh visual treatment to this song...' Hardly anyone shoots urban sydney, skate grime locations. When was the last time you saw an urban sydney skate grime location in an Australian hipster video?

Hispsters playing in the forest with keyed out (data mosh?) color faces actually seems really obvious to me. Not at all fresh.

To top it off the flimsy narrative for this is almost emo in nature.

I'm sorry Sharpie but you don't actually seem that sharp to me.

         

Kansas you nob,

I never said that I'd seen heaps of videos shot in 'urban sydney, skate grime locations'. It is merely my opinion (which im entitled to) that i felt it an un-obvious setting to use for the introduction of a new, up and coming sydney skate-rat band from Castle Hill.

In visual treatment, let me be more clear here. By visual treatment Im thinking of the setting/ colour / the woods / nature / water / sand / seaweed / the bigger picture, not (and i agree with you) the cheap keyed out face trick.

I don't use the same fine tooth comb when viewing an indie-budget video for an unkown band as I would a video with a muuuch bigger budget and artist. This type of comparison will always be chalk and cheese.

I don't want to get into a debate with you, you seem to spend a lot of time arguing and debating on this site about the most un-important and irrelevant shit anyone can even imagine, so you'd probably smash me with all the practice you get stirring shit.

I just choose to look at it glass half full. I simply pointed out things i like about the video, not what i don't.

Actually, off the top of my head, Ive remebered a video directed by your favourite guy:

Ghostwood, urban sydney-grimey location, also for debut video, also for modular videos.antville.org

         

An unobvious setting? Ridiculous. Hipsters are all about the forest and barren landscapes. It's Australia and New Zealand, that shit is everywhere.

Budget has nothing to do with it in my books. I am always more impressed by ideas and concepts. A bigger budget does help. But then with more money comes more responsibility and often more people having their say in the shape of the video.

There is no excuse here for the concept being lame.

On a personal note: you spend as much time arguing on this site as i do (your doing it now) but in this case I will simply agree that the Ghostwood video was worse than this one although not by much.

         

yeh, okay, watever, agree to disagree.

this is a subjective thing... Im all for strong ideas, but equally Im for good craft (not to say im always style over substance) and sometimes i think obvious shit can be good too. I really feel that there is some good craft in this... ie, i if the idea, narrative is crap / weak, at the very least i appreciate the influence of a talented DP's hand in the piece in terms of how its shot... in saying this, there's clearly some good directing talent involved here... if only a glimmer of it.

and yes i do argue a bit on this site, but the amount i argue pails in comparison to your verbal diarrhea... and may i say, atleast I don't do it behind the guise of an anonymous avatar, and im only arguing because in the few years ive posted here, you are actually the very first to have a go at me... so what im i to do? Say nothing, come across like a pussy, or hit back, and unfortunately fuel another useless antville debate.

For the record, Im not a Spiccia hater... sure, i dont like a few of his things that have been posted in the past, but at the same time id be the first to give respect to many of the other amazing things he has created, in particular his commercial work.

         

I'm with Kansas on this one - hipster emo turd.

         

I'm with Kanye on this one - I like it.

         

This is a low blow but linking your 'avatar' to some of your work isn't exactly helping your credibility here 'Sharpie'. I would have taken you more seriously if you had been anonymous.

         

well Kansas, the photo blog linked to my avatar is basically a fun exercise for me to take unusual photos in an unusual way... thats all it is, nothing more nothing less.

You might not enjoy my shots, but the judges at this years Canon photo 5 competition seemed to like my entry so much that i made the 10 finalists from 1329 entries in my category. Go check it out and vote kansas, every vote counts mate!!

My entry: www1.canon.com.au

The rest: www1.canon.com.au

I stand to win a 5D, so hopefully then, perhaps ill be able to create video work to give me this 'credibility' thing you speak of.

         

Sorry Leslie I didn't know I was talking to a visual genius. A box head with some glasses drawn on it... intriguing, genius even.

Good one mate!

Maybe throw another prawn on the barby for me and I'll fly over so we can discuss art, film and culture etc...

         

haha, kansas, youre such a raging douchebag. I never said that im a 'visual genius', i really don't take what i do too seriously, i just have fun with it.

But, im more concerned about what someone like Chris Searl (the judge who selected my photo) thinks as apposed to an anonymous ass like you.

...you know what 'fun' is right?

         

haha sharpie, you're such a raging douchebag.

You just have fun with it but your concerned about what chris searl thinks? Doesn't quite make sense?

I know what fun is but judging by your photo you don't.

By the way good luck with that ego of yours mate! Hope it sees you through the early 20's without having to think too much.

         

         

         

kansas, are you always loud like this?

ps: i liked this - s3.amazonaws.com

         

cheers Matei, but apparently just not good enough in kansas' eyes.

         

No not good enough in my eyes. Apologies if I have a more refined taste and therefore much greater expectations. You can't expect to please everyone.

Whether the glass is half full or half empty it's still not a full glass. I don't know about you but I usually prefer to pour a full glass unless the bottles empty.

         

What is someone with "refined taste" doing trolling a music video site? Go watch Masterpiece Theater or something.

And oh geeeeeeez, if you don't understand how important a budget is in the production of a music video, then just shut up now and never pipe up on this board again.

         

oh geeeeeez, not another retard who doesn't understand the importance of the idea over production value. Of course budget is important, I say that above. However if budget was the only factor in determining a good video then why isn't every one of Hype Williams or Raging Nation's videos a work of genius? How do people like keith Schofield get bigger budgets in the first place? Because people like his ideas OR because he has always had big budgets and high production values??

I say a more refined taste not a refined taste. Meaning that I am not so easily impressed by crummy, indie hipster, style over substance, no idea videos. If you are impressed than you probably need to concentrate on your education rather than hitting back at me because you don't understand.

         

kansas, youre not saying anything i don't think we all have heard many times before.

"its all about the idea man", "whats the idea behind it" etc etc.

You think what you're saying is so new and that your point of view is so f-cking enlightened...

All that you are doing though, is repeating the same rhetoric that i have heard many a times from the maaany old fart creative dudes ive met in my life (mainly ad creatives), art teachers, university and college lecturers.

Old farts always use your argument of 'whats the idea' because in a world where they are loosing relevancy, they need something to fall back on in their defense when they don't understand something new like emerging/ progressive technologies, styles etc.

The way you constantly refer to 'hipsters' is exactly how old farts refer to "those damn young guys with underpants sticking out and skinny jeans hanging below their asses"...

which makes me think that you're either an old fart, or you're just young, haven't actually had any real world experience, like perhaps you're currently a uni student who is basically repeating how your lecturers critique you or your work when you fall out of line and try something new that they don't understand.

         

Kansas,

1. Not every great video is just "a great idea". 99 Problems is a video that's all about emotion and performance, and I'd say it's extremely effective despite not having some high-concept idea. Jonathan Glazer, Mark Romanek, Chris Cunningham, David Fincher- these are just a few of the great directors who created amazing videos that dealt more with atmosphere and storytelling than strong viral ideas. Their videos would not have been possible without a much healthier budget than is usually available today. Budget was KEY in making their ideas come to life.

2. Sometimes great ideas take lots of money to accomplish. Sure, Christopher Walken dancing to Fatboy Slim in a hotel is an interesting idea, but you're going to need more than just a camera and a lighting kit to do it. In fact, you're going to need more money than most people make in a whole year to pull it off correctly. Does your idea have people flying through the air? Does it have cgi tomfoolery? Does it have costumes, art direction, or choreography? Those all require a healthy budget.

3. Sure, Keith's videos often have really great ideas, but they also require adequate budgets to accomplish. The idea in the Lenny/Justice video is strong, but would it have worked at all without the 80s art direction/costumes and competent fx? I'd say the Beck video he just did is less about a strong idea and ALL about the execution. It looks like a million bucks, and it wouldn't have been possible to do it without a healthy budget.

4. I'm guessing that you're a fan of music videos, not someone involved in making them (although possibly from the label side). Please try to go make a music video. Then report back to us about how you feel about budgets.

         

Budget,

I don't want to add to any more site drama- but I think you speak the truth^

I know that most of my video ideas (that I successfully pitch inside my head :P) REQUIRE some Hype Williams-sized budgets. Anything less than (that is, cheap means like DV or what have you) would be a real disaster.

And even as a university student (ouch Sharpie) I'm definitely not against the practical side of making videos. I know that comment wasn't directed at me specifically but STILL.

         

^^ agree with budget.

surprise, surprise the Kansas troll has struck again!

Why do people continue to bother feeding this insignificant parasite?

         

Budget,

I am not talking about viral ideas. I am talking about ideas. Good story telling means having a good story, ie a good idea. There are thousands of directors that can tell a story and create atmosphere but if the actual story / idea sucks to begin with then what are you left with? Tell me that?

The directors you mentioned are still in my books known for their ideas / stories just as much as actual story telling and atmosphere. Actually I would say they are better known for their interesting ideas / stories.

I agree with everything you are saying about the necessity of a good budget. But I don't think a good budget necessarily means a good video and that a small budget necessarily means a bad video.

I really do believe the Beck / Gainsbourg video whilst very much aided by its production values would still have been an interesting and noteworthy video if it had been shot with the same budget as the above video. However if you were to give more budget to the above video then in what way is it going to improve? Or f you were to take away the cinematography from the above video then what have you got left? Some hipsters frolicking through the forest with sticks and then for no reason kill their friend on the beach? Awesome?

If you really want to settle this argument then heres my homework for you: Make two videos of equal budget for the same song. For the first sink all of your energy, time and budget into creating a good story / idea. For the second video just sink all of your budget, time and energy into achieving the most dramatic atmosphere with the highest possible production values without any consideration at all to story or idea. Then post both videos up here and see which one receives the better response.

         

budget, Glazer has AMAZING ideas. Virtual Insanity? Rabbit in Your Headlights? Street Spirit (way before the Phantom)? He's amazing at execution but his best videos are INSANELY creative.

kansas, I agree. Ideas are music videos. Look at the directors with great concepts - Jonze, Gondry, Glazer. They went on to make great films.

Look at the guys with great style and so-so concepts. Hype, Dave Meyers, McG. Lame ass movies.

Music videos aren't features, but I'll take the first group over the latter any day.

         

haha, although glazer is my favourite director, i still dont get street spirit; what to you may be a very coherent structure, to me is a mood-drenched video playing on random albeit spectacular images. that's why i love it.

         

Legion, it's still a great idea. Maybe not narrative but still a great idea.

         

ok, great idea, but which is it?

         

Oh and Sharpie just caught up to read your last comment. My, my, just take a step back and listen to yourself dude. What you are saying is that having an idea is old news and basically just relying on technology and style is the new thing?

Maybe just stop and think about that for a second. Basically your saying creativity is a joke right? Is that what your saying?

Maybe just think about who your favorite current directors or photographers are. Have a look at their work. Do you really think they are just relying on new technology and style??? Or do u think maybe they are using new technology in aid of their ideas? And where do you think emerging styles come from? Thin air you think? Maybe from how people interpret technology to again aid their ideas?

Oh my I really have rattled your feathers haven't I. You seem to be crumbling at the edges. Hold it together dude. Please.

By the way skinny jeans with ass hanging out kind of went out of fashion about 3 years ago. Sports jocks have now claimed this style. For me the term Hipsters refers to people who follow the latest trends blindly without any real IDEAS of their own.

         

ps thanks captainmarc22

         

do any of you guys work for a living? i would have thought you could spend less time bitching at each other and maybe go make your own videos? none of you are right, none of you are wrong. when you get that you might stop bickering. its boring.