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Antville Awards 2009

Hello Antvillers,

i'm concerned about the fact that progosk will not be available to organise this year Antville Awards. Is anybody willing to do it? I'll be more than happy to help.

tommy514, December 10, 2009 at 3:57:36 PM CET

I could help! For La Videotheque, i'm doing a top50. I watched over 2000 music videos this year.

Let me know how you want to handle this, i can help for sure.


almotasim, December 10, 2009 at 6:26:18 PM CET

Great Tommy. All help is welcomed. I guess the first thing would be to congregate all 2009 monthly Antville favs (as a starting point) and open the nominations.

Same categories as last year?

captainmarc22, December 10, 2009 at 7:34:51 PM CET

we need to revise the "urban" category. It should basically be - the BET award. What was the best video that would actually play on BET?

Mainstream (US) Hip hop videos are a totally different breed than any of the indie stuff. Different rules, different expectations. But there's still creative stuff in there.

Last year, a bunch of obscure hip-hop and foreign stuff made it in. To me, that was just pointless.

The Peter Fox clip, as cool as it was, is not the same thing as doing a Lil Wayne video. Even Kano's Hustler - which was fantastic - is on a different level because UK rap videos are much more like US & UK indie/rock videos. I mean, Wiley "Cash in my pocket" was a great clip this year, but that is not going to be playing on BET. Ever.

So, yeah, sorry that's all very specific and anal. But I feel like this category has never been fully realized. Everyone always complains that antville has a bias towards rap videos - and that specifically means US mainstream rap videos. That's why this category is important and should be consistent.

progosk, December 10, 2009 at 9:45:31 PM CET

cap, haven't things moved on a little? i mean, megaforce doing kid cudi (never mind it got shelved)? surely to be pointful, a category should reflect the times, no? (also: you'll never will the 'ville out of the general bias here. errban is making in-roads, but nah-right this place ain't...)

captainmarc22, December 10, 2009 at 10:09:12 PM CET

but that's just the thing. The Megaforce video got shelved, perhaps, because it didn't feel hip-hop enough. Who knows.

I just like the idea of a category where we can compete the Gil Greens, Anthony Mandlers, and yes, Hype. Those guys will never be able to beat the hipster cred of Antville's favorites; but they shouldn't have to.

almotasim, December 10, 2009 at 11:14:19 PM CET

So, what are you proposing? Ending the urban prize? What should replace it? And if we do so, wouldn't this open the door to other categories such as best indie? This looks to me as a pandora box.

kevathens, December 10, 2009 at 11:51:54 PM CET

I'd say get rid of urban. I'd help but I'm not sure if people want my help?

progosk, December 10, 2009 at 11:54:31 PM CET

people, k? it's the 'ville that needs ye.

my name is legion, December 11, 2009 at 12:07:18 AM CET

the urban category is the sole category im ever interested in

familiar, December 11, 2009 at 12:10:36 AM CET

Kev, would be great if you helped with this.

captainmarc22, December 11, 2009 at 12:40:41 AM CET

just rename it "Best video that BET would play."

Rap videos suck because so many are the exact same thing: girls in clubs performance videos. And often when rap videos try to be creative - think of 50 Cent's video where he sampled footage from the Phillips TV ad - they're laughably horrible. So it makes sense to award the directors that can work in that mold but do something cool.

In theory, we could do a "best mainstream pop video" but that would be fuzzy because a lot of mainstream pop videos can be really creative (Lady gaga, Madonna, etc.); so they have no problem competing with the indie stuff.

We could also do a "Best CMT (Country) video" but I don't think I've ever seen a Country video posted here. And no one complains about that.

And I guarantee you the winner of best video of the year WILL be an Indie video. It has been every year.

or just drop the urban category all together. But then, again, I guarantee that the list will be all indie videos, with a few nods to "Bad Romance" - which I think will be this year's "Single Ladies."

brigs, December 11, 2009 at 3:32:16 AM CET

keep "best urban". ditch "most fun" or turn it into "best indie" and add "best rock" or something similar. just my 2 cents.

captainmarc22, December 11, 2009 at 3:46:45 AM CET

i like "most fun." It's where you put those stupid videos that made you laugh but you wouldn't call "video of the year."

almotasim, December 11, 2009 at 11:36:58 AM CET

Hi Kev, i would like very much to count with your most precious help. Could you e-mail me? joaopedrodacosta at gmail dot com

true_fiction, December 11, 2009 at 6:58:59 PM CET

Divide the Urban awards into U.S. and International

otc, December 11, 2009 at 8:51:53 PM CET

I'll help. The Ville 2K volunteer tabulation system worked out pretty well, I think we can probably do something similar with this.

I hypothetically like the idea of an urban category for the same reasons captainmarc said, but after seeing what got nominated last year I don't think it turned out right. Kanye hated "urban" but somehow I think he might be more offended by winning the "best video that BET would play" award.

And fuck CMT I've tried watching those videos before and I can't do it.

Keep most fun.

As I recall last year's ballot stuffing caused a discussion on representative democracy. A couple of possible strategies for next year were outlined in the comments:

  1. After the nominee shortlist is made. Nominate 15-20 "antville senators" to be the final selection committee. This was eventually dismissed as elitist and against the spirit of the boards (I don't really like this method either).
  2. Leave final votes in the comments instead of as anonymous poll. This way new screen names and ballot stuffers would be slightly more obvious. The downside is that it's too hard to distinguish between stuffers and longtime lurkers who don't comment often.
  3. Make the voting process obtuse enough that the director's mom and friends will be too lazy to want to do it. I like the idea of requiring an email address with a fake warning that voting will automatically sign you up for the daily antville newsletter.
  4. Disable new membership subscription during the 5-day voting period so that only registered antville members can vote. This seems like the best solution to me but it may not be technically possible and it would require the site admin's help. (that's tobi right)?

captainmarc22, December 11, 2009 at 9:18:33 PM CET

i don't have a problem with the voting poll method. Usually the ballot stuffing was a problem with nominations; but we've solved that by having it be in the comments. It's never going to be perfect, but I think the last few years worked out fine. Just add a big disclaimer to not have people advertise any ballot stuffing, and if they do they'll be disqualified.

And it's easy to see who's a first time account and who's a longtime user. Just use the google.

Rename the Urban category "Best US Mainstream Rap video." Not every category has to be perfect. But we should have it, as the merits of rap videos have been an endless source of debate.

Here's an idea: before the nominations are announced, we have a separate post for the finalists in the category. Then, the ville can pick it apart and reject ones that don't fit the mold.

We don't need to do this for other videos; because it's clear what's a performance video, what's an animated video, etc. But people don't seem to get the basic concept that directing a mainstream US rap video is a very different process than other US genres or anything in the UK.

Maybe we can rename it to "The Hype Williams Award."

my name is legion, December 12, 2009 at 12:34:10 AM CET



progosk, December 12, 2009 at 9:48:33 AM CET

can i nominate legion as official megaphone? (seriously!)

the longer yall quibble about what to call one of the MANY categories, the surer you are to not getting a whole lot done. solution? make it a vote. right here, right now:

Leaving all the Antville Awards categories as they were last year, what should the category for all the rap/hip-hop/urban/BET-played videos be called this year?


my name is legion, December 12, 2009 at 10:44:39 AM CET



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